3rd reading in the Lords
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- My Lords, the Bill will permit the Northern Ireland Assembly to delegate powers in relation to the setting of salaries and expenses for Members of the Northern Ireland Legislative Assembly. Currently, the Assembly is explicitly prevented from doing so under Section 47(7) of the Northern Ireland Act 1998, which states that the Assembly may not delegate such functions. The Bill therefore removes this restriction, thereby enabling the Northern Ireland Assembly, should it so decide, to confer the functions of setting salaries and allowances for Members of the Assembly on an independent body of its choosing. Although this is a short Bill with only three clauses, we have had a thorough and constructive debate throughout all of its stages in this House. At Second Reading in Grand Committee, it became clear that noble Lords wished to use the Bill as a means to address the issue of dual mandates. The Government recognised the strength of feeling on this issue, and on Report I returned to the House with two government amendments. The effect of these amendments was that any MLA who was also a Member of either House of Parliament or Member of the European Parliament would not receive any salary for their position as an MLA. Noble Lords recognised the Government’s willingness to seek a compromise on the sensitive issue of dual mandates and agreed to the amendments, for which I am grateful. This means that the Bill before us has the full support of the House. Through effective co-operation, we have shown yet again how the House can work together in order to find common ground. Motion
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Baroness Royall of BlaisdonLabour- Quote
- That the Bill do now pass.
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Lord KilclooneyCrossbench- Quote
- My Lords, I will be brief. I spoke on this previously. I was uneasy about the restriction on people having dual mandates. I mentioned that there were people in Northern Ireland with triple mandates. The Nobel laureate, Mr John Hume, was an elected Member of the Northern Ireland Assembly, an elected Member of our national Parliament and an elected Member of the European Parliament. We had the same situation with the leader of the DUP, Dr Ian Paisley. I understand the restrictions on them getting three salaries, or three sets of expenses; but it is a dangerous step for Parliament to decide who people can or cannot vote for. We are restricting who can be a candidate in elections. That is a very dangerous train for Parliament to take. One further question was brought to my attention in Northern Ireland.
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Lord GlentoranConservative- Quote
- My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Kilclooney, has got it slightly wrong. The Bill does not stop people being elected: it only ensures that they cannot take three salaries.
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- Lord KilclooneyCrossbench
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- I was coming to my next point, which was brought to my attention in Northern Ireland. Can a Member in Northern Ireland be elected to the Irish Parliament in Dublin, and will this in any way affect his allowances or salaries?
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- Baroness Royall of BlaisdonLabour
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- My Lords, first I endorse what the noble Lord, Lord Glentoran, said: all that the Bill does is restrict salaries. If the people of Northern Ireland wish to elect one person to two posts, that is entirely up to them. I am told by my noble friend that this has no bearing on allowances in the Irish Parliament, but I do not think that that answers the noble Lord’s question, so I will come back to him in writing. However, I do not know of anyone who serves in two Parliaments in two jurisdictions. I may be wrong about that, but I will come back to the noble Lord in writing. I am floundering here. I think that the best thing for me to do is to come back to him in writing and to put a copy of the letter in the Library.
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Lord AlderdiceLiberal Democrat- Quote
- My Lords, on Second Reading I raised two questions regarding the Speaker of the Northern Ireland Assembly: first, the re-election of the Speaker; and, secondly, the pension arrangements for the Speaker. The Leader of the House responded very constructively and undertook to write to me on those, and I am in a position to reassure the noble Lord, Lord Kilclooney, that when she says that she will write, she does. She responded very constructively to the questions that I raised and I want to acknowledge that. The noble Baroness made it clear that in respect of the re-election of the Speaker, the intention of the Northern Ireland Office and Her Majesty's Government was to explore the question with the parties in the Northern Ireland Assembly after the devolution of policing and justice, and that if there was agreement on that, they would bring forward a legislative instrument in your Lordships' House and in the other place. As for the pension arrangements, she rightly pointed out that although it is currently a matter for the Northern Ireland Assembly Commission—and perhaps subsequently for an independent body—the matter had been brought to the attention of the authorities. I want to acknowledge that, too, as it was discussed off the Floor of the House. It is important to record my appreciation, and I think the appreciation of others, that the noble Baroness took this seriously.
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- Lord GlentoranConservative
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- My Lords, I thank the noble Baroness and everyone else who has taken part in the very constructive debates we have had over the various Readings. I should also mention Mr Goggins, in another place, with whom I have had a number of conversations in trying to reach agreement on our amendments, despite the fact that he was involved in Hillsborough and other things. As the noble Baroness said, this has been a very good example of what this House can do to get sensible results out of a certain amount of disarray. Bill passed and sent to the Commons.
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